Ohio

Discussion of the Falcon football team.

Re: Ohio

Postby MarkL » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:09 am

jpfalcon09 wrote:All I know is BG used an external search firm to find candidates for the football vacancy which is what any athletic department would have done.

Normally yes. Kingston did not use a search firm for Jinks because he was already tracking his candidate mid season. One of the many reasons that hire was a disaster. A search firm probably wouldn't have even looked Jinks' way (Texas lifer, only three years college experience) for a MAC level head coaching position. Babers left for Syracuse literally the day after the MAC championship win as he had already interviewed and probably had a draft contract already written. The following Tuesday, three days later, Jinks was hired where normally it takes a week or two for a MAC program to hire a new coach.

Kingston either a) was already a foot out the door during the hiring process or b) wanted to show off his ego by hiring a diamond in the rough right as PJ Fleck came out of nowhere to bring WMU from obscurity to championship caliber. Or both.
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Re: Ohio

Postby TalonsUpPuckDown » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:40 am

BGSU33 wrote:
zete wrote:I don't think I have ever seen a more uninspired defensive effort from a BG football team as I witnessed last night.


I was thinking the same thing. I’ve seen us get sliced up many times before, but can’t recall seeing such a lack of effort as this. And let’s not forget, Ohio could have scored 80-90 points if they really wanted to. Thankfully they showed some mercy with 66 points in the third quarter and decided to help us end our misery. I would rather see us play reserve guys who actually want and will try than guys who are starters and won’t. If that means we give up 80 next week to Buffalo, so be it. We’re going to lose anyway, I’d rather at least see us go down with guys who are actually trying. I know we lack depth everywhere, but if we’re starting and playing some guys who won’t play with effort, then let someone who will. I mentioned earlier in this thread a particular play that happened last night that I don’t think I ever saw happen before, and I still don’t understand the logic. If he would have ran over and patted the guy on his back as he took it to the house it would have been more effort than running over to him, slowing up and watching him run right beside you, then chase him to the endzone. He literally didn’t lay a finger on him, he actually slowed up and let him go untouched past him. It was one play that wouldn’t have changed the outcome of the game, but it’s those kind of plays that will continue to keep us buried at the bottom of FBS football and essentially summed up what we look like as a program right now. We simply go through the motions and don’t put in the work or effort, and the end result is our record and scores. When we lose, we don’t just get beat, we get destroyed. And when you see this kind of lack of effort, everyone can see why no matter what kind of picture our coach tries to paint. And yes, while the Kingston decision has led us down this road to this mess, it can’t absorb all the blame for what we still see on the field right now.


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Re: Ohio

Postby Schadenfreude » Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:43 pm

drumstix2388 wrote:Watch his post-game presser and you can see how he has a very clear vision for how this is going to go, and I believe he will get us there if he's given the opportunity.


That's what I see when I see him speak: Vision. He seems to have thought about every aspect of this football program quite deeply. Remember when he was quoting a geographical analysis of where our players came from when we were winning MAC titles? That struck me as next level.

I think he'll get us there. He seems driven in a way that reminds me of Urban Meyer.
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Re: Ohio

Postby Flipper » Wed Nov 20, 2019 4:29 pm

Loeffler looked like he wanted to vomit on the sidelines last night. I can relate....

If my math is right...we can make about a 8-9 player dent in the scholarship deficit if we sign 25...that doesn't include any additional departures or walk ons from last year that get scholarships. I think we struggle to reach .500 next year with that cliche'd third year telling the real story.

Interesting that they're going to try to recapture a year for McDonald via a medical appeal. With him and Loy in place next year, QB should be OK
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Re: Ohio

Postby roguewarrior » Wed Nov 20, 2019 4:51 pm

Thoughts:
Mcdonald at QB will be a world of difference. We win 5 this year with him and don’t get decimated in a few of the other games.
QB Milton is intending to early enroll, as are rumored about 5 of the current commits. Early enrolling ups the timetable for frosh immensely, if they have the skills to play right away.... If NCAA ups the scholarship max, that could completely change the timetable. That’s what we should be praying for!
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Re: Ohio

Postby AyZiggy97 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:51 pm

MarkL wrote:
jpfalcon09 wrote:All I know is BG used an external search firm to find candidates for the football vacancy which is what any athletic department would have done.

Normally yes. Kingston did not use a search firm for Jinks because he was already tracking his candidate mid season. One of the many reasons that hire was a disaster. A search firm probably wouldn't have even looked Jinks' way (Texas lifer, only three years college experience) for a MAC level head coaching position. Babers left for Syracuse literally the day after the MAC championship win as he had already interviewed and probably had a draft contract already written. The following Tuesday, three days later, Jinks was hired where normally it takes a week or two for a MAC program to hire a new coach.

Kingston either a) was already a foot out the door during the hiring process or b) wanted to show off his ego by hiring a diamond in the rough right as PJ Fleck came out of nowhere to bring WMU from obscurity to championship caliber. Or both.



I don't come to defend Chris Kingston. Well, not entirely. He made two terrible hires for football and I lay the state of the program mostly on him. But it's hard to argue with the on court success of Chris Jans. And Michael Huger has proven to be a good hire.

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Re: Ohio

Postby Flipper » Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:05 pm

Two horrible football hires?
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Re: Ohio

Postby mbenecke » Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:54 am

Flipper wrote:Two horrible football hires?


I assume Dino Babers is included in that.

And I agree to an extent. He's a guy who can maximize talent, but he'll decimate a program once the already-recruited talent leaves. To be frank, he has played a big part in the numbers issues from the past few years. He maximized the talent that was already at BG (thanks, Dave!) and then left before it got bad. He had a great season at Syracuse last year, but they're 4-6 this year.

He strikes me as someone who will strike while it's hot for a HC job. It's what he did to leave Nothwest Ohio, and he probably should have after his 10-win season at Cuse last season.

I don't hold it against him, because that's the system, and I always want guys who have spent Saturdays in the Doyt to do well wherever they go. But I don't think he's blameless around here.
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Re: Ohio

Postby jpfalcon09 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:13 am

I still maintain a theory that Kingston had some sort of patronage with Jinks and/or his agent. Highly suspect that CK left to take a job with Learfield in Texas of all places shortly after he hired Jinks. Too many events line up to make it seem strictly coincidental.
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Re: Ohio

Postby Schadenfreude » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:20 pm

I seem to remember seeing that Kingston gave a presentation to some industry organization -- an association of athletic directors, perhaps -- about how he ended up selecting Jinks. I bet it was recorded. If so, gosh I'd love to see it. But I don't hang out in these athletic department circles like some of you.
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Re: Ohio

Postby guest44 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:28 pm

Kingston was beyond proud of how he found Jinks. He told everyone about it. He even allowed the concept of Jinks not having an actual agent to become public knowledge. An actual athletic department hired a D1 Football coach in 2015 without an agent. That happened. Go back and read the Twitter timelines of the Kingston crew. They were so proud of finding Jinks. Then, once his high school staff & spring practice rolled around, the distancing began.
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Re: Ohio

Postby Flipper » Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:09 pm

I hold Dino Babers virtually harmless for any blame re the state of our program. Two years...he was here two years. His one full recrutiing class was decent...it's not his fault Jinks ran Morgan off to FIU. He had a bit more attrition than Clawson...but it was nowhere near as bad as Jinks. Sotolongo, Bozeman, Lautanen, etc....I think there were more starters on defense tis year brought in by Babers than Jinks.

He left Jinks enough talent that he was able to go 4-8...eventually..his first year. After that, when Jinks had to replenish the stock...he was cooked.

Regarding Loeffler's press conference post game...he's DONE. He's done playing the pat you on the back and hope you get it game. You either perform or you don't...end of story
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Re: Ohio

Postby Class of 61 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:29 pm

Not surprised, but didn’t Babers “take” a couple of what would have been our top recruits with him to Syracuse? This left us a bit on short side in numbers too. But Jinks was obviously over his head and I recall being chastised by someone when I alluded to his inexperienced staff, not to mention minimal Ohio and/or Midwest connections.
Wonder how he personally is doing at USC, since that program is struggling now.
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Re: Ohio

Postby jpfalcon09 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:38 pm

Class of 61 wrote:Not surprised, but didn’t Babers “take” a couple of what would have been our top recruits with him to Syracuse? This left us a bit on short side in numbers too. But Jinks was obviously over his head and I recall being chastised by someone when I alluded to his inexperienced staff, not to mention minimal Ohio and/or Midwest connections.
Wonder how he personally is doing at USC, since that program is struggling now.


My guess is he'll be looking for a new job after the season once Clay Helton is fired.
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Re: Ohio

Postby MarkL » Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:45 pm

Schadenfreude wrote:I seem to remember seeing that Kingston gave a presentation to some industry organization -- an association of athletic directors, perhaps -- about how he ended up selecting Jinks. I bet it was recorded. If so, gosh I'd love to see it. But I don't hang out in these athletic department circles like some of you.

I tried to find it when this discussion began. It is taken down now. It was an interview with a talent management firm. Kinston promoting himself about how he hired Jinks. It was informative and a strange mix of reassuring and concerning. The interview raised a major issue with me: Kingston was sold on Jinks from the beginning without meeting the guy which made every other candidate competing with Kingston's idea of Jinks rather than an interaction with the actual guy. Kingston even referred to Jinks as the "target" of the search in their sit down. I'm not sure he actually interviewed anyone else.
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