Coaching Updates

Discussion of the Falcon football team.

Re: Coaching Updates

Postby TommyG » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:34 am

The negative with hiring some of these guys with impressive resumes you may only have them for a year. The positives though are they are proven at least to some degree of being able to develop players.
Obviously Van Gorder didn’t work out at ND, but he must have shown some type of coaching ability to land that position in the first place. Plus the pressure will be significantly less and probably much easier to just do his job. I’d be surprised to see a dramatic turnaround in year one, but having a staff that can teach is certainly a step in the right direction.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby jpfalcon09 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:57 am

TommyG wrote:The negative with hiring some of these guys with impressive resumes you may only have them for a year. The positives though are they are proven at least to some degree of being able to develop players.
Obviously Van Gorder didn’t work out at ND, but he must have shown some type of coaching ability to land that position in the first place. Plus the pressure will be significantly less and probably much easier to just do his job. I’d be surprised to see a dramatic turnaround in year one, but having a staff that can teach is certainly a step in the right direction.


If the coaches can get an extra 15-20% out of the current roster, an additional 1-2 wins isn't out of the question. We saw what Clawson was able to do with Brandon's recruits in 2009 before the attrition issues really hit hard. I'm a firm believer that changing the culture is a giant step forward towards establishing a winning program and that appears to be the first step this staff is taking.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby Flipper » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:35 am

Based on the Athletic article...Loeffler has the Urban Meyer work ethic going..hopefully, he doesn't burn out.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby Antimob » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:11 pm

jpfalcon09 wrote:
Antimob wrote:The whole "Give Back Fridays" thing is fine and good, but I hope people remember that this is a Division I FBS college football team and not a community service volunteer organization. It's a commendable thing to do but we must be very careful to make sure it doesn't predominate a la Louis Orr's religious obsession. We see a steady stream of tweeted pictures of people in jerseys handing out presents; I'd like to see some Kelvin Tolbert-led weight lifting or speed training.

I'd like to "Give Back" some of those losses to Toledo over the past few years and the way to do that is to get better at playing football.


Lest we forget a year ago this program was in the midst of perhaps its most embarrassing off-season with players getting arrested and videos of assault. I'll gladly take players doing good in the community, building relationships and character, than seeing names in the blotter.


That's a great point and something I didn't even think about. (Although our so-called embarrassments were either things every program has or massively blown out of proportion due to the fish bowl mentality that exists in the community.)

Still, I'm hesitant about the program seeking to be defined by things other than winning. This isn't Little League or the local Elk Club. I'm glad we're reading to kids and handing out gifts but quite frankly those things can be done by anyone anywhere. These are Division I players coached by Division I coaches recruited and paid to win. A focus on winning needs to be the overwhelming, unambiguous message presented. Replace "Aw, those are such fine gentlemen" with "Damn, these guys are serious about winning a championship."

Perhaps it's more PR than reality because from everything I've seen our new HC and staff want to win desperately. The whole "give back" formulation always strikes me as odd generally. What are they taking, exactly? They play football for pete's sake, they're not a gang of parasites marauding the countryside.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby MarkL » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:52 pm

Sorry. I wear orange and brown glasses but what happened with players ending up in the police blotters the past couple years does NOT happen everywhere. Not everywhere do you have players stalking women and kicking them in the face. Not everywhere do you have players getting in fights over spring break. Everywhere, by definition, does not lead the nation in off season arrests. I gladly welcome positive community engagement.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby Antimob » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:57 pm

MarkL wrote:Not everywhere do you have players getting in fights over spring break.


Weren't they defending a girl being assaulted? Good for them.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby mbenecke » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:58 pm

I'd take more of a balance of both. We have some good kids in this program, and they deserve to be commended for the work they do outside of their classes and outside of practice. However, I would also love to see more inside of practice and checking out the work these guys are doing in the weight room. It's work that it's one thing to hear about, but it's a whole other thing entirely to see.

I like the direction Loeffler is taking this program in. I just hope it translates to wins on the football field.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby pdt1081 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:53 pm

Antimob wrote:
Still, I'm hesitant about the program seeking to be defined by things other than winning. This isn't Little League or the local Elk Club. I'm glad we're reading to kids and handing out gifts but quite frankly those things can be done by anyone anywhere. These are Division I players coached by Division I coaches recruited and paid to win. A focus on winning needs to be the overwhelming, unambiguous message presented. Replace "Aw, those are such fine gentlemen" with "Damn, these guys are serious about winning a championship."

Perhaps it's more PR than reality because from everything I've seen our new HC and staff want to win desperately. The whole "give back" formulation always strikes me as odd generally. What are they taking, exactly? They play football for pete's sake, they're not a gang of parasites marauding the countryside.

You see it as just some football players reading books to kids. Others see it as the only positive interaction with an adult male some of the kids may have.

Believe it or not, these players are role models for kids in the area. Getting to meet and interact with them can actually change a kid's outlook on life. Work in the school district (teach, para, volunteer) and you'll see exactly the kind of influence these players have.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby MarkL » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:57 pm

Antimob wrote:
MarkL wrote:Not everywhere do you have players getting in fights over spring break.


Weren't they defending a girl being assaulted? Good for them.


No. They weren't. One of the guys continually kicked a man in the face while he was down on the ground. That is indefensible.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby footballguy51 » Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:29 am

pdt1081 wrote:
Antimob wrote:
Still, I'm hesitant about the program seeking to be defined by things other than winning. This isn't Little League or the local Elk Club. I'm glad we're reading to kids and handing out gifts but quite frankly those things can be done by anyone anywhere. These are Division I players coached by Division I coaches recruited and paid to win. A focus on winning needs to be the overwhelming, unambiguous message presented. Replace "Aw, those are such fine gentlemen" with "Damn, these guys are serious about winning a championship."

Perhaps it's more PR than reality because from everything I've seen our new HC and staff want to win desperately. The whole "give back" formulation always strikes me as odd generally. What are they taking, exactly? They play football for pete's sake, they're not a gang of parasites marauding the countryside.

You see it as just some football players reading books to kids. Others see it as the only positive interaction with an adult male some of the kids may have.

Believe it or not, these players are role models for kids in the area. Getting to meet and interact with them can actually change a kid's outlook on life. Work in the school district (teach, para, volunteer) and you'll see exactly the kind of influence these players have.


This is also a great way to engage the public and encourage those local people to come to the games. If the starting linebacker is reading to my kid, I'm more inclined to go watch his game and cheer for him.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby Antimob » Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:40 pm

Of course there is nothing inherently wrong with chipping away at our manifold social ills and perhaps collecting a few new fans along the way. I suppose my point would be that we’re a college football team that hasn’t defeated its primary rival in a decade and just hired a new coach. The majority of our external public relations strategy has thus far consisted of mushy, soft-focus evidence of volunteerism rather than things directly relating to football and reversing the outcome of that rivalry. Most people seem to like it but it doesn’t come close to satiating the ravenous appetite for red meat my particular palate is desirous of.

Also, while I don’t don orange-colored glasses (although those would be cool!) I do abide by the following principles concerning my team:

-I give them the benefit of the doubt and believe in innocence until guilt is proven.
-I examine things in the context of their age range as 18-22 year old football players and the corresponding behaviors of other 18-22 year olds elsewhere.
-I refuse to immediately embrace as fact narratives advanced by sensationalist, incomplete, dishonest media reports that willfully ignore the previous two principles in their “reporting.”
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby MarkL » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:28 am

-I give them the benefit of the doubt and believe in innocence until guilt is proven.

Legally yes. Being a college football player is a privilege. All of us who donate to the Falcon club want to see young leaders and athletes emerge. It is not asking much to hold scholarship athletes to a higher level.
-I examine things in the context of their age range as 18-22 year old football players and the corresponding behaviors of other 18-22 year olds elsewhere.

If you find kicking a woman in the face, getting in fights over spring break, and credit card fraud all behaviors representative of 18-22 year olds, then you know the wrong 18-22 year olds. Whatever the previous staff was doing in character evaluation, they were clearly doing something wrong. Thankfully there is a new staff with presumably a new culture.
-I refuse to immediately embrace as fact narratives advanced by sensationalist, incomplete, dishonest media reports that willfully ignore the previous two principles in their “reporting.”

Fake news! When you see police reports that state the same as the media reports, the reporting is none of sensationalist, incomplete, or dishonest. And I am as big a critic of media malfeasance as anyone.

Look. I'm sick of losing. Utterly sick of it. And I live nowhere near Ohio so I can name on one hand all the MAC alums (besides BG alums I know from alumni events) that I personally know and interact with frequently, so I'm not hearing the trash talking that anyone in Ohio is probably hearing. But I want to win the right way. I want to win games where I am thrilled with the final score and not embarrassed by the police blotters.

And that is one of the many reasons I am so glad to have a new staff to lay down a new culture with a fresh start. "Mushy" volunteerism will go a long way to bringing more folks to games beyond the die hard fans like myself and so many here. So I welcome it and can hope that it is paired with hard work, good practice, and leadership development behind the scenes.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby Antimob » Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:37 pm

We'll have to agree to disagree on a few things but a couple final points:

-Innocence until proven guilty is the bedrock of our legal system. Playing football is a privilege but being an American citizen comes with certain privileges also, namely justice by due process and not by mob.

-I would personally lump the woman kicking incident in a separate category from a spring break scuffle in defense of a woman and exchanging money for textbooks for personal use. The first is reprehensible, the second understandable and the third disappointing yet hardly uncommon among college athletes (see the University of Florida and multiple other examples.)

-Teaching kids to read should be about teaching kids to read, not a linchpin of a marketing strategy to boost attendance. History has proven that one thing and one thing alone will bring this about: winning, which we both agree we're starving for.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby pdt1081 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:19 pm

Antimob wrote:We'll have to agree to disagree on a few things but a couple final points:

-Innocence until proven guilty is the bedrock of our legal system. Playing football is a privilege but being an American citizen comes with certain privileges also, namely justice by due process and not by mob.


There is no "due process" when it comes to University implemented punishment. ALL Students are subject to a code of conduct. Any violation is subject to the University's discretion.
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Re: Coaching Updates

Postby jpfalcon09 » Fri Apr 19, 2019 9:14 am

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